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if you remember, math by details in the sitdown between boehner and obama last year. boehner's office wouldn't write the number 800 billion in its initial offer to the white house because they didn't want other house republicans to see that. the fact that that figure is on the table and boehner is taking to the air waives to say, you know who's going to get soaked here? the rich. is a shocking reversal of where the republican party was i agree ago. >> look at this. these are some smart conservatives. byron york in "the weekly standard," and john padora, bill kristol are all saying the republicans have to do something. they're playing a losing hand. fedoris writes, every way you look at it, the gop is trapped. republican politicians will cave and give the president most of what he wants. the only real question is, when? the answer is, probably at the worst possible time when they've done even more damage to the party's brand. governor, if you were a republican today, would you sitting down say, you know we have to eat this, deal with this top 2%, we can't be seen as ha
if you remember, math by details in the sitdown between boehner and obama last year. boehner's office wouldn't write the number 800 billion in its initial offer to the white house because they didn't want other house republicans to see that. the fact that that figure is on the table and boehner is taking to the air waives to say, you know who's going to get soaked here? the rich. is a shocking reversal of where the republican party was i agree ago. >> look at this. these are some smart...
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. >>> obama to boehner, get serious. let's play "hardball." ♪ >>> good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. let me start tonight with this. the republicans have their plan, and it's great news for the rich. speaker john boehner just put it out. those at the top, the 2%, are safe. your bush tax cuts are going to keep on giving. one problem, mr. boehner, you lost. that was your position before the election, and you lost. mitt romney campaigned on keeping the tax cuts for the wealthy, and he lost. and he promised to do what john boehner is doing right now, and he lost. how about some respect for the electorate? how about seeing what the 2012 presidential debate was about? obama championed tax fairness and won. republicans championed protecting that 2%, ignoring the 47% he talked about, and they lost. today boehner said he's willing to raise revenues by the same amount he agreed to back in august of 2011, the last time they had this fight. again, he's willing to act like the election never happened. no wonder. again, he lost. joining me is joy reid of the grio
. >>> obama to boehner, get serious. let's play "hardball." ♪ >>> good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. let me start tonight with this. the republicans have their plan, and it's great news for the rich. speaker john boehner just put it out. those at the top, the 2%, are safe. your bush tax cuts are going to keep on giving. one problem, mr. boehner, you lost. that was your position before the election, and you lost. mitt romney campaigned on keeping the...
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deep in the obama boehner negotiations, they were talking about a proposal with 800 billion in revenue that would come through a somewhat tax reformed process. right now we're seeing the exact opposite. president obama is sticking firm with what he offered in his budget release, or at least in his opening bid and boehner is kind of chasing over obama with more or less compromised proposals saying, why won't you work with me, give more, sacrifice more? look, we're early here and most of the people i talk with in washington are saying we're not going to get deep into this until mid-december at least. if we do a process of kind of incrementally coming from in between the two proposals, you could very easily imagine between obama and boehner on tacks is $1.2 trillion. that's where they end up on mandatory spending, 750. that wouldn't be a shocker either. boehner's opening bid here is not the bid of the side in the stronger position. it's a side desperately trying to get the press to compromise. >> now, michelle whark we don't see in the counteroffer is extension of payroll tax cut, extensi
deep in the obama boehner negotiations, they were talking about a proposal with 800 billion in revenue that would come through a somewhat tax reformed process. right now we're seeing the exact opposite. president obama is sticking firm with what he offered in his budget release, or at least in his opening bid and boehner is kind of chasing over obama with more or less compromised proposals saying, why won't you work with me, give more, sacrifice more? look, we're early here and most of the...
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if boehner and obama could come together they could get within done in an hour but they have to worry about the left and right. that's why a lot of bluster. >> i think nancy pelosi will be key there will be a lot of defections on the republican side, nancy pelosi stays in the house she is a great whip. she has to convince a lot of democrats to vote yes. there are going to be been fit cuts, cuts to entitlement, otherwise republicans are not going to go along with any type of tax increase. >> greta: people make business decisions based on what they predict is going to happen. congress and the president have held us in abeyance for a year and a half on this issue which has stall the economy, people -- while they sit and lay their game and their vacation everything else, they've stalled the impact. >> the idea of all of the bush tax cuts going away, is a serious thing. here again, the president could win, having them all go over, that's an extraordinarily serious event.ss whether republicans take this offer from yesterday, whether they take it personally or they just say well -- >> greta:
if boehner and obama could come together they could get within done in an hour but they have to worry about the left and right. that's why a lot of bluster. >> i think nancy pelosi will be key there will be a lot of defections on the republican side, nancy pelosi stays in the house she is a great whip. she has to convince a lot of democrats to vote yes. there are going to be been fit cuts, cuts to entitlement, otherwise republicans are not going to go along with any type of tax increase....
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you've got a existed in in president obama versus a lose her in john boehner. and here is boehner again yesterday, on fox news sunday saying, when he looked at the president's proposal, oh my god. >> i was flabbergasted. >> flabbergasted. >> he can't be serious. i just have never seen anything like it. we've got seven weeks between election day and the end of the year three weeks have been wasted with the nonsense. who is flabbergasted anymore? have you ever heard that word? >> peter: an old word. >> 1920s called. they weren't there. >> bill: yeah, my great aunt madeline used to say, "flabbergasted" she was 90 then. >> i was waiting for him to say we got beat, it was a slobberknocker. >> maybe they say that in the bar. the other thing is t flabbergasted? he has known about this plan. you can check it out. this is nothing to be flabbergasted about. this was out there long since the election and ever since. >> a non--serious proposal. the president was asking for $1.6 trillion worth of new revenue over 10 years, twice as much aziz been asking for in public. stimu
you've got a existed in in president obama versus a lose her in john boehner. and here is boehner again yesterday, on fox news sunday saying, when he looked at the president's proposal, oh my god. >> i was flabbergasted. >> flabbergasted. >> he can't be serious. i just have never seen anything like it. we've got seven weeks between election day and the end of the year three weeks have been wasted with the nonsense. who is flabbergasted anymore? have you ever heard that word?...
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president obama and speaker john boehner actually talked to one another. it was on the telephone. it was not the face-to-face meeting the speaker says is necessary, but it was the first time that the two men have spoken in a week. for the latest on these stalled negotiations, we turn to fox news chief white house correspondent ed henry forhe report. >> trying to lay blame for stalled buet talks on republicans, president obama today wrateted up pressure on boehner. >> nobody wants this done more than me. >> for the first time, plan for massive spending cuts from going over the fiscal cff warning business executives, the economy could take another hit if republicans cide to extend just to middle class tax cuts to avoid the cliff for now and come back next year with more leverage to tie spending cuts and medicare reform to another hike in the nati's debt ceing. >> we're not going to play that game next year. if congress, in any way suggests they tie negotiations to debt ceiling votes, and take us to the ink of default again as part of a budget negotiation, i will not play that game.
president obama and speaker john boehner actually talked to one another. it was on the telephone. it was not the face-to-face meeting the speaker says is necessary, but it was the first time that the two men have spoken in a week. for the latest on these stalled negotiations, we turn to fox news chief white house correspondent ed henry forhe report. >> trying to lay blame for stalled buet talks on republicans, president obama today wrateted up pressure on boehner. >> nobody wants...
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in an interview with julianna goldman of bloomberg news obama called the boehner plan quote out of balance. >> i think that we have the potential of getting a deal done, but it's going to require what i talked about during the campaign which is a balanced responsible approach to deficit reduction that can help give businesses certainty and make sure that the country grows. and unfortunately the speaker's proposal right now is still out of balance. he talks for example about $800 billion worth of revenues but he says he's going to do that by lowering rates. when you look at the math, it doesn't work. >> rose: and here is the president talking about why it's essential for him that there be tax increases for the most wealthy among us. >> i don't think that the issue right now has to do with sitting in a room. the issue right now that's relevant is the acknowledgment that if we're going to raise revenues that are sufficient to balance with the very tough cuts that we've already made and further reforms and entitlements that i'm prepared to make, that we're going to have to see the rates on the
in an interview with julianna goldman of bloomberg news obama called the boehner plan quote out of balance. >> i think that we have the potential of getting a deal done, but it's going to require what i talked about during the campaign which is a balanced responsible approach to deficit reduction that can help give businesses certainty and make sure that the country grows. and unfortunately the speaker's proposal right now is still out of balance. he talks for example about $800 billion...
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for rolling over as he saw it on the deal with obama. >> everybody is playing this down. i don't. eric ericsson wrote his supporters an e-mail saying this, without jim demint we would most likely not presently have in the united states senate pat tomby, rand paul, mike lee, marco rubio, jeff flake, ron johnson, ted cruz. we had not have a republican establishment that worries that conservatives might actually primary them. de menthe also had backed candidates who went on to lose their general elections. richard mourdock in indiana, christine o'donnell in delaware, ken buck out in colorado. bob, i'm going to back to this again. when the chief ramrod of the rift wing senate candidates leaves the post, who would replace him? how is this good news for the right? >> look, i'm not saying whether it's good news or bad news, i'm tell you what i think his calculation is. his calculation is he can be more of a free agent. i think he will get very involved in primaries, he will push hard right issues. i wish him well because the candidates e succeeded in nominating have quite often
for rolling over as he saw it on the deal with obama. >> everybody is playing this down. i don't. eric ericsson wrote his supporters an e-mail saying this, without jim demint we would most likely not presently have in the united states senate pat tomby, rand paul, mike lee, marco rubio, jeff flake, ron johnson, ted cruz. we had not have a republican establishment that worries that conservatives might actually primary them. de menthe also had backed candidates who went on to lose their...
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so like john boehner said today we're at a stalemate and not really moving forward as president obama would hope. >> all right. many thanks, katy pavlich, appreciate the rundown. >>> both president obama and speaker john boehner took turns today finger pointing on the fiscal cliff talks. take a listen to this. >> it's not acceptable to moo a me to you for members of congress to hold middle class tax cuts to hostage simply because they don't want tax rates on upper income folks to go up. >> the white house spent three weeks trying to develop a proposal, and they send one up here that calls for $1.6 trillion in new taxes, calls for a little not even $400 billion in cuts. it was not a serious proposal. >> all right. so where are we right now? even while the fate of our fragile economy hangs in the fiscal cliff balance, for that let's turn to our distinguished guests. peter goodman. he's the huffington post business editor on a former "new york times"man. we welcome back republican congresswoman nan hayworth and haddy heath, senior policy analyst with the independent women's forum. okay.
so like john boehner said today we're at a stalemate and not really moving forward as president obama would hope. >> all right. many thanks, katy pavlich, appreciate the rundown. >>> both president obama and speaker john boehner took turns today finger pointing on the fiscal cliff talks. take a listen to this. >> it's not acceptable to moo a me to you for members of congress to hold middle class tax cuts to hostage simply because they don't want tax rates on upper income...
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the aides to boehner and obama are still there. there are times the though even this week that it will get frustrated and stop talking to each other. i'm not sure if they're talking today or taking the day off. obama said yesterday that this could get done in about a week. i think he might be right. republicans see the writing on the wall when it comes to tax increases. what they're interested in now is making sure they get spending cuts to go along with the tax increases. when obama put his additional offer, he said $1.60 trillion in tax increases and we will delay the spending cuts until next year. that was the initial offer. republicans want to make sure that the spending cuts go up and become more immediate. considering that obama has been open to spending cuts in previous negotiations and says he is open to it now and republicans have changed from where they were a year ago when it comes to tax increases, i think it will not take too much to get their, although there are still obstacles. host: the $1.60 trillion and $800 billi
the aides to boehner and obama are still there. there are times the though even this week that it will get frustrated and stop talking to each other. i'm not sure if they're talking today or taking the day off. obama said yesterday that this could get done in about a week. i think he might be right. republicans see the writing on the wall when it comes to tax increases. what they're interested in now is making sure they get spending cuts to go along with the tax increases. when obama put his...
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what worries me about the boehner/obama relationship, it seems like it's almost nonexistent. they can't even shake hands at a party, for goodness sake. >> and in many ways, i blame the republicans for not coming up with a real deal, not recognizing what the voters did. at the same time, i think obama has been very, very poor at applying the personal charm and chemistry that the president can. dragging people off to camp david. and we don't know whether or not that would work. but he hasn't tried it. and when a government budget is at stake -- >> larry, they did feel offended by president obama's last offer. they felt it was so outrageous. >> it was outrageous. it was double what they saw last year. it had spending increases, rather than spending cuts. and it wanted to have congress lose its role, in term terms of increasing the debt ceiling. none of that's probably going to happen. and i think to nick's point, it's a good point. if you go back and look. i worked for reagan years ago. reagan and tip o'neill would sit and work together. i'm not saying they'd do every detail. >>
what worries me about the boehner/obama relationship, it seems like it's almost nonexistent. they can't even shake hands at a party, for goodness sake. >> and in many ways, i blame the republicans for not coming up with a real deal, not recognizing what the voters did. at the same time, i think obama has been very, very poor at applying the personal charm and chemistry that the president can. dragging people off to camp david. and we don't know whether or not that would work. but he...
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president obama has john boehner boxed in and is done playing games. now it's getting good. this is "the ed show." let's get to work. >> let's allow higher rates to go up for the top 2%. that includes all of you. >> the president holds the line on taxes and draws the line on the debt ceiling. >> i will not play that game. >> tonight, democratic whip steny hoyer gives me the latest fiscal cliff developments and the democratic line on medicare. tom perriello from the center of american progress action fund on how democrats can deal with republicans who can't deal with reality. rubio and ryan reload with a new message for the middle class. >> both parties tend to divide americans into our voters and their voters. >> but there is no escaping their own policies. >> we're going to a majority of takers versus makers in america. >> dnc chair debbie wasserman schultz responds tonight. plus, senator barbara boxer on her new plan for national polling place standards. and a new poll shows half of all republicans think the defunct group a.c.o.r.n. stole the election from president obama.
president obama has john boehner boxed in and is done playing games. now it's getting good. this is "the ed show." let's get to work. >> let's allow higher rates to go up for the top 2%. that includes all of you. >> the president holds the line on taxes and draws the line on the debt ceiling. >> i will not play that game. >> tonight, democratic whip steny hoyer gives me the latest fiscal cliff developments and the democratic line on medicare. tom perriello from...
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even with the clock ticking it's almost two week since president obama and john boehner met in person. nbc news confirms two leaders spoke by phone for 15 minutes last night a call described by politico as short and curt. boehner gave his state on the current talks a moment ago. >> no substancetive progress has been made in the talks between the white house and the house over past two weeks. all eyes are on the white house. the country doesn't need a v victory lap it needs leader. >> behind the scenes of the contours of a deal are starting to take shape, a trillion plus dollars in tax heights, entitlements of $400 billion and 1.2 trillion in spending cuts to offset the dreaded sequester. if the phoners haven't been gabfests the president is chatting up other folks including small business owners, middle class americans and mitt romney-loving ceos. if awkward meetings are par for the course in washington, the president's one today takes the cake. later this hour, president obama will sit down for a post-election chitchat with the prince of awkward, the king of tilted conversation and u
even with the clock ticking it's almost two week since president obama and john boehner met in person. nbc news confirms two leaders spoke by phone for 15 minutes last night a call described by politico as short and curt. boehner gave his state on the current talks a moment ago. >> no substancetive progress has been made in the talks between the white house and the house over past two weeks. all eyes are on the white house. the country doesn't need a v victory lap it needs leader....
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the call unlike the night when president obama called john boehner on election day and john boehner didn't answer his call. i think that you have to have both parties willing to engage with each other and talk to each other. looking back at the 1980s, for example, when ronald reagan was president and tip o'neill was speaker of the house, they didn't agree but they sit down and talk and negotiate and compromise and today's republican party so hijacked by the right wing they're incapable of agreement. >> let's put aside the right wing here. we know that speaker boehner purged some of those seen as not being team players within his own party and we'll discuss the fact he's taken a hit for that. beyond the right wing or whatever you have numbers. you have exit polling. you have pew research poll that shows where the american people stand. if all of the people are there to represent us, meaning the people who are watching right now and the panel included here, we are all americans, we pay taxes, then why isn't this work getting done? >> well, just look at speaker boehner's fiscal cliff p
the call unlike the night when president obama called john boehner on election day and john boehner didn't answer his call. i think that you have to have both parties willing to engage with each other and talk to each other. looking back at the 1980s, for example, when ronald reagan was president and tip o'neill was speaker of the house, they didn't agree but they sit down and talk and negotiate and compromise and today's republican party so hijacked by the right wing they're incapable of...
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this comes on the heels of a phone call between president obama and speaker boehner which occurred credit. my sources are telling me the phone call lasted for about a half an hour. politico described it as curt, but may sources say that's not necessarily the case. so of course treasury secretary tim geithner coming in to the hill trying to move the needle on the fiscal cliff and we're hearing that there are sort of broad outlines of a framework emerging. but of course they really need to put some meat on the bones. what does that mean in terms of increasing taxes and cutting medicare. to those are some of the issues being hammered out today. >> kristen, thank you so much. so as we said, it is tim geithner's day on the hill. is this a sign that talks are being accelerating or hitting stumbling blocks? joining me now senator kent conrad. sir, great to have you here. we showed the headline at the top of the show, from politico, the fiscal framework emerging. are the contours of the deal really taking shape? you heard kristen welker saying the description of that phone conversation may not ha
this comes on the heels of a phone call between president obama and speaker boehner which occurred credit. my sources are telling me the phone call lasted for about a half an hour. politico described it as curt, but may sources say that's not necessarily the case. so of course treasury secretary tim geithner coming in to the hill trying to move the needle on the fiscal cliff and we're hearing that there are sort of broad outlines of a framework emerging. but of course they really need to put...
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speaker boehner is about to respond to president obama's demand that we raise tax rates. listen in, please. >> and it's exactly how we approached our discussions in the biden group, my discussions at the white house a year and a half ago, and for that matter in the joint select committee. and if the president doesn't agree with our proposal and our outline, i think he's got an obligation to send one to the congress and a plan that can pass both chambers of congress. if you look at the plans that the white house has talked about thus far, they couldn't pass either house of the congress. we're ready and eager to talk to the president and to work with him, to make sure that the american people aren't disadvantaged by what's happening here in washington. >> good morning. you know, i think at this point pretty much most folks in the country and certainly in this town know where both sides are on taxes. i think we understand that. but to the speaker's point, we have not had any discussion and any specifics with this president about the real problem -- stuart: speaker boehner is
speaker boehner is about to respond to president obama's demand that we raise tax rates. listen in, please. >> and it's exactly how we approached our discussions in the biden group, my discussions at the white house a year and a half ago, and for that matter in the joint select committee. and if the president doesn't agree with our proposal and our outline, i think he's got an obligation to send one to the congress and a plan that can pass both chambers of congress. if you look at the...
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boehner needs to paint obama as the one who is holding the country hostage. he wants to talk about holding the middle class hostage? no it's him holding the entire country hostage and our kids hostage, with his krin call refuse ool to enter the entitlement reform game. >> wow, he is really bad. >> stephanie: yeah i can see why he didn't get the radio show. >> sheky. >> stephanie: that was so merrill osmond. >> merrill was kind of the leader. >> stephanie: i dove donnie. steve doocy. >> europe is great because they have wonderful food and runny cheeses, but we shouldn't base our policies on theirs because they are stinkers. >> we should base it on singapore where they have no unemployment, and they have a competitive market. that protects workers. >> stephanie: we should be like singapore? >> oh my god. holy crap. he is a bigger idiot than i thought. he is not even trying to hide what a douche bag he is. >> stephanie: okay. bill o'reilly. really? is this his whole december? >> there is no doubt that your day you christian tradition in this country is under att
boehner needs to paint obama as the one who is holding the country hostage. he wants to talk about holding the middle class hostage? no it's him holding the entire country hostage and our kids hostage, with his krin call refuse ool to enter the entitlement reform game. >> wow, he is really bad. >> stephanie: yeah i can see why he didn't get the radio show. >> sheky. >> stephanie: that was so merrill osmond. >> merrill was kind of the leader. >> stephanie: i...
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in other words, boehner would have a merlot, and obama would chew nicorette. >> you point outside in the book somehow when they took the official photo, both of those vanished. >> yes. they had iced tea there for obama. of course, boehner had his seg represent, and they put the cigarette in the ashtray away for the picture, but they have not closed the deal on the personal relations, and that's a shame. i think if somebody, instead of sponsoring your breakfast and all, sponsor a weekly dinner between obama and boehner and everyone would agree to pay for it and let them just talk and get to know each other and see, you know, it's -- >> how much -- >> oh, that's right. what do you think? >> i think that's a great idea. [inaudible] a special room. >> i'm not sure -- [inaudible] >> yeah, okay, but, well, you know, but, i, you know, personal relationships, when john was the fbi spokensman, he was not helpful, but you could talk to him, get him on the phone, and if you had a good story, he'd confirm it by laughing, a deep laugh meant you were on the right track. no laughter meant no. [laug
in other words, boehner would have a merlot, and obama would chew nicorette. >> you point outside in the book somehow when they took the official photo, both of those vanished. >> yes. they had iced tea there for obama. of course, boehner had his seg represent, and they put the cigarette in the ashtray away for the picture, but they have not closed the deal on the personal relations, and that's a shame. i think if somebody, instead of sponsoring your breakfast and all, sponsor a...
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i just can't imagine that happening with barack obama and john boehner. they just seem complete polar opposites. >> as you suggested, obama doesn't really have an appetite for this sort of thing. we saw that last time around and if you read bob woodward's "the price of politics" it's one of the themes that comes through loud and clear. he's doing some things differently this time, though and one thing that i think is very interesting, he's taking his case to the american people and doing it day after day. all of us have talked on this show and other places about how bad the president has been in the past on selling what he wants to happen, on explaining his policies and really bringing people around to them. and we see him now trying to do that in a more forceful way than he's done in the past. and that may strengthen his hand further. >> also, do you think -- sorry. ross, do you think the deal in the end when it gets done, as it obviously will get done at some stage, do you think the republicans will by then, whether they want to or not, have moved on th
i just can't imagine that happening with barack obama and john boehner. they just seem complete polar opposites. >> as you suggested, obama doesn't really have an appetite for this sort of thing. we saw that last time around and if you read bob woodward's "the price of politics" it's one of the themes that comes through loud and clear. he's doing some things differently this time, though and one thing that i think is very interesting, he's taking his case to the american people...
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comes down to john boehner and president obama. i will reed an excerpt from pegeny noonan in the "wall street journal" would disagree with melissa this is not the old-school politic s yore. beggy writes -- when fire logs burned without fire starters and apple pies were baked in everybody's home. >> not sold in costco. >> if only everything could be like ronald reagan. >> and tip o'neill. >> the thing is, and i think it is true that -- i know peggy noonan likes the grand er and everything grand, but the senate isn't so relevant. this being a budget and tax bill they can do reconciliation. this is a house problem. the difference is that tip o'neill actually had influence with his caucus. john boehner has precious influence with the part of his caucus the most recalcitrant on these issues. in the current lame duck congress john boehner still has the same problem, resistant people who will not go along with a deal so the question is, whether or not he can deliver even the 20 or 25 votes he needs if pelosi did what she always does and d
comes down to john boehner and president obama. i will reed an excerpt from pegeny noonan in the "wall street journal" would disagree with melissa this is not the old-school politic s yore. beggy writes -- when fire logs burned without fire starters and apple pies were baked in everybody's home. >> not sold in costco. >> if only everything could be like ronald reagan. >> and tip o'neill. >> the thing is, and i think it is true that -- i know peggy noonan likes...
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is a failure, he gave into obama. they want to hear him talk the talk. while he still has the rejectionists in hand in the lame duck caucus and while he has that donor class that wants to hear this conservative rhetoric, he's still got to play the game. behind the scenes i think republicans understand they're going to lose that top rate fight. they're going to lose that, and i wouldn't be surprised if they wound up putting the debt ceiling into the deal at the end, but up until the moment they make the deal, he's got to talk the talk. >> if i was only interested in right wing money and money at the top, i would say that's all true and, therefore, the faster they make a deal the better because if they're going to raise the rate anyway, get it over with. >> it would be better for the republicans if they make a deal now. >> boehner can make a better deal now. the question is whether anyone in the party will let him do that. >> thank you. we agree on almost everything except it is a cliff. coming up, seriously, haven't th
is a failure, he gave into obama. they want to hear him talk the talk. while he still has the rejectionists in hand in the lame duck caucus and while he has that donor class that wants to hear this conservative rhetoric, he's still got to play the game. behind the scenes i think republicans understand they're going to lose that top rate fight. they're going to lose that, and i wouldn't be surprised if they wound up putting the debt ceiling into the deal at the end, but up until the moment they...